In episode 64 of The Kitchen Table, Ken Baden interviews Chad Michael, a prominent figure in the roofing industry, to discuss his journey from early struggles to becoming a successful entrepreneur. Chad opens up about his past experiences, including time spent in federal prison, and how he overcame challenges to build a thriving business in the insurance restoration industry.
Tune in to gain insights into the importance of owning your story, embracing authenticity, and finding purpose in life.
TIMESTAMPS
[00:06:44] Impact of Sharing Stories.
[00:10:58] Overcoming Insurance Adjusters as Contractors.
[00:11:32] Building Codes and Insurance Claims.
[00:16:50] The Power of Contractors.
[00:21:03] Creating Success in Any Business.
[00:24:26] Roofing Industry Trends and Insights.
[00:27:47] Entrepreneurial Journey and Challenges.
[00:31:50] Overcoming Setbacks and Mistakes.
[00:38:17] Overcoming Fear and Shame.
[00:44:50] Overcoming Past in Ohio.
[00:45:22] Embracing Imperfections and Vulnerabilities.
[00:51:21] Overcoming Challenges in Life.
[00:53:26] Love and Appreciation for Partners.
In this episode, Ken Baden and Chad Michael underscore the importance of embracing failures and past mistakes as integral parts of one's personal journey. Chad reflects on years spent in shame and fear of exposure, ultimately realizing the necessity of controlling his own narrative. By acknowledging his missteps and embracing his past, Chad was able to move forward, focusing on his personal and professional development.
Overall, Chad's journey highlights the significance of self-reflection and personal accountability. He emphasized the importance of facing one's mistakes, learning from them, and using them as motivation to strive for a brighter future. By accepting the past and taking responsibility for one's actions, individuals can pave the way for positive change and personal growth.
QUOTES
SOCIAL MEDIA LINKS
Ken Baden
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/officialkenbaden/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/officialkenbaden
Chad Michael
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chadmichaelmedia/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ChadMichaelUSA/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chad-michael/
WEBSITES:
The Kitchen Table Podcast: https://thekitchentablepodcast.net/
Blue Collar Ballers Union: https://bluecollarballersunion.com/
Insurance Restoration Training: https://insurancerestorationtraining.com/
Welcome to the Kitchen Table, a podcast about where business is done. So pull up a chair and join your host, Ken Baden.
Intro/Outro
All right, welcome back to another episode of the Kitchen Table podcast. I'm your host, Ken Baden. And today we have got Chad Michaels. And I'm really excited about this one. Chad, thank you for coming virtually from Dallas, Texas. How are you, my friend?
Ken Baden
I'm having a great day. Thank you so much. Enjoyed the eclipse yesterday here in Dallas.
Chad Michael
You were in Texas, so you actually got to like see it. Totality.
Ken Baden
Yeah. Unreal.
Like what the heck's the big like in Maryland? It was like you had a few idiots and like outside with these glasses on. I'm like, it's like barely even darker here. I was like, all right. But I saw there it was like dark, right?
Yeah, it was totally dark. It was unreal. I mean, just looking up at the sky had like diamonds, you know, just coming around the edge of the The sun is unreal to be there.
Was that planned or just coincident?
Yeah. Well, you know, it's funny because I live in Ohio, which is also in that same path. Oh, and so I didn't really plan anything around it. And I kind of thought I was leaving the area in Ohio and that I would miss it. And I didn't really know much about it. And then I heard, you know, I figured out that it was basically the area that I was driving.
I drove that path. people were like doing what you're doing. They were Airbnb-ing and flying from all over to be in Texas for us. That's cool. So Chad is a kindred spirit in a couple of ways, but he's a big name in the roofing industry. I, it's funny story. I was getting ready to tell you this on the phone, but like how I knew who you were is way back when. And it's not that long ago really. Cause my background's in retail. So like, I didn't know what this insurance hubbub was all about other than the fact that I was always really dismissive of it. And when I say insurance, us retail guys, like, you know, they were always like two different industries. They're just two different worlds, right? Like I sold in retail and I started in a company called Power. And I've have since been at many other companies. And, you know, I've got my own consulting firm and stuff and very much like Adam Bensman, I've got the whole, you know, my, my sales methodology and the things I do, but it's no recreated wheels. It's just the same stuff with my little flair. But I always stayed away from the insurance side until, you know, I was at a place that bought Lee hates sky diamond university and watched his stuff. And I was a VP of sales at this place. I'm like, man, I don't, I don't, I saw the writing on the wall and like these guys were getting ready to convert to insurance. So I went and did my own thing. And then inevitably we ended up finding the insurance game at my own thing like a year later. And we bought a module and you were the guy on like most of the Xactimate videos and a lot of the O&P videos and all that stuff. I think it was Delmetico stuff, the SVGU. And that was like, you were one of my, you were very informative and I loved your vibe and I loved, it's just, I've known who you were for a while ever since then, but I've seen you since then grow into this like much bigger, and you know what? I have another funny story for you, Chad. I paid for your talk two years ago or a year ago and we didn't get to go. Me and Brett, we went and he was coming to Maryland. I paid like 800 bucks for like per ticket. which I'm sure is well worth it. And I couldn't go, couldn't go. And I was like, damn, you know, like Chad's coming to town.
So that always amazes me. I always figure there's a story behind every one of those tickets where they bought the ticket and they don't show up. And I'm just like, I actually hate that. I hate that. I mean, cause I mean, we expect that those people are going to come to, so.
Trust me, we weren't like, you know, I was like, damn, I can't remember what exactly it was. But I mean, I wasn't I wasn't happy about it myself. But I mean, I was I'm really excited to have you here today, not just to pick your brain about roofing. I mean, that's our demographic is all encompassing of anything, I would say, like blue collar, but also different entrepreneurs. But sure, there's a lot of roofers that listen to this. And, you know, you and I were talking and your background, you said something that I thought was really cool. And it was about your story. And I think I can't wait to hear it. But you also said something about like the trials, the tribulations and kind of like how low we get, where we come from, those things we go through. and I feel like there's so many of those things that are behind like every really great man or woman that we see out there today that's just like achieved so much that more often than not there's this like tumultuous past that kind of catapulted them into who they are today. So I'm really excited to hear about yours if you would be so kind as to share it because I see you doing all the talks and, you know, I look at you and I'm like, this guy is very much the roof strategist in his own right in that. And I think all things exact to my exact to me. And I don't know, man, like I really have a lot of respect for you in what you've carved out in your area. And so, like, I'm excited to have you on here, but I'm even more excited to hear about your story. So, oh, man, I'm honored about it.
Yeah, I'm honored, you know, to be here and to be on your show and to be asked to do this. I mean, I'm very I'm honored to do that and I'm grateful for the opportunity. So and thank you for those things that you said about me. I really love to hear people's story about how they how they heard about me or people come up to me at my events and they they tell me stories on claims that they won or you know just or their whole business turning around and they watched all the this guy's like I binge watch it I have it in my ears all the time I go to sleep listening to it I just blows me away because I don't not everybody hardly anybody comments and says those things you know so you just wonder like you know that there's a lot more views and and things so you wonder if you're having an impact so that just I appreciate you saying that big time thanks for having me on.
I'm stoked to have you on. Yeah, I mean, my cousin and I were just talking and I'll have to, uh, hopefully we can continue this relationship. And again, I won't be so selfish as to just, cause I could, I could be very selfish and I could just ask nothing but roofing questions and about exacting mates and how to get things bought. But I am not going to do that. I promise I might ask a question or two, but in all seriousness, my cousin, uh, for us writes all of our supplements and, At least for now, he's our supplement manager. And I don't mean to say that I'm like, I mean, we'll have to hire others. And ideally, he'll be in charge of that. But he was like, maybe he's a ask him if he's a three or what? I don't know. Like, I guess that's your level. There's only 500 level three certified guys.
Yeah. So, well, I'm not an exact to make trainer. I don't do the official exact where training and I know you've seen You know, I know what you're talking about, the modules that you're watching.
Yeah, you probably just happen to be talking about that at that point.
Well, I do really what I specialize in the most is inspections, estimates and supplements. And so I've had an online training course for six years now. It's called IES certified dot com. That's what the IES is, Inspections, Estimates, Supplements. And you saw some of those modules from that course. And there's certification that we do of our own. And there's, you know, comes with testing and things. But part of that in the estimating is really thinking of how to build one of these estimates as a contractor, right? And when you go through the Xactimate training, it's a little bit different of a mindset because this is the same training that you use to train adjusters. And so my training is just, and I'm very clear, like this is not Xactware certified training, but I want to show you how I build an estimate, you know, from start to finish and some things that I do that they won't show you. And, you know, some other things that they do show you that I really don't use as much. So I'm not, I refer people all the time out to specific exact where, you know, certified trainers, if that's what they're looking for. But I mostly talk about things, you know, I think more than anything, what people that come to my events, mostly contractors, they're there to learn new tactics and strategies on how to overcome and neutralize insurance adjusters. And that's because insurance adjusters are constantly trying to drive prices down, not cover a lot of items, and they rely on policy and coverage to say, the policy doesn't include this, or the policy doesn't over this. And as a contractor, unless you're in the state of Illinois, you can't talk about policy and coverage as a contractor. That's sort of out of bounds. And so you can't say, well, yeah, but the policy says this or the policy says, you know, you're out of bounds. That's sort of acting as a public adjuster, an attorney. It puts the contractor in a position where they have one arm tied behind their back. They're put at a disadvantage. And the adjuster has this advantage. And people are frustrated by that. Contractors are frustrated by that. Because essentially, all of the adjuster estimates that I've ever seen, thousands, every single one of them have been short. They're short because there's not enough line items on the estimate. Next to every line item, there's a dollar amount, right? And there's a lot of reasons why line items are missing, but it comes from the inspection first and foremost, how these estimates are generated. So I talk about more of a top-down approach on how to overcome insurance adjusters in multiple ways and winning in the lane of the contractor. One big thing that people miss, and I want to give some value here in all ways, if you do, I know it's about entrepreneurs and we'll talk about that.
Thank you so much. This is your area, man.
Yeah. I mean, if there are roofers here, I want them to hear, you know, something that I feel like most contractors miss. I've, I've met personally thousands of contractors and all markets across the country and, and a couple of hundred of my training events. And I find that most of them, most of them like overwhelming percentage of them, 90% of or more are missing this huge, huge, factor that could give them the advantage with insurance adjusters. And here's what it is. building codes. Like it's so amazing. Like, and people are like building codes, that's boring, you know, and that's, that's hard to understand. But most people I find, uh, most contractors don't know a thing about building codes. They're supposed to, you know, the, the clients probably believe that all contractors do, uh, you know, even if they're licensed in some of the more strict States, they don't understand building codes and how to use those with insurance claims. Most insurance claims, most policies have what's called ordinance and law, OL coverage, and that's building code compliance. People think of it as building code upgrade coverage, but it's building code compliance, meaning that any repairs that have to be made, if there's anything that's not up to code, it must be brought up to code during those repairs. And the insurance company has to pay for that. Not all policies have it, but most do. You know, so just a couple quick examples of that at four roofers, all flashing, all flashing must be replaced where rusted, damaged or deteriorated. So you can tell by rust, you can tell that deterioration, you can tell that, well, it's going to be damaged during the tear off. Sure, but it's already damaged now because there's nail holes in it. So a picture of those nail holes along with that code could get that approved. All right, so that's anything like chimney flashing, skylight flashing, the L flashing, sidewall flashing, step flashing, any kind of flashing at all. All the vents, all the pipe jacks, everything must be replaced according to that code. And now the reason why that gives a contractor a huge strategic advantage, or at least neutralizes and equalizes that playing field with the insurance adjuster, because we start out with our one arm tie behind our back, is because insurance adjusters don't know jack about building codes. They don't know. They don't know anything about Bill. They're not required to know them. It's not part of their training or their studies or any tests that they take. It's not part of any training for any carrier that they ever go and work for. So you can have that code in that picture that I just mentioned, and they sometimes won't approve it because they don't understand it. So you have to overcome that challenge. But decking, they don't want to pay for decking because it's rotted decking and the policy excludes rot. Well, also, though, if the policy has ordinance and law coverage, it's not rotted, it's water damage. And there's four different different building codes that gets that deck bought. So must be solidly sheathed. A lot of people hear about that. I mean, if it has too many nail holes or if it's cracked or warped or wet, it's not solidly sheathed. You can't roof over top of anything that has a water saturated roof covering and or underlayment. That's a building code. So if there's any water there, that's not gonna work. You can't roof over top of any water soaked decking. That's a third building code. Fourth, you must comply with all manufacturer specifications. So there's at least four building codes there. So I just, I think that there's a lot of additional armor right there. If you, if a contractor would decide to be a contractor.
The second layer, like my buddy and I were just arguing about this the other day. I think it's just like I know in a code here in Maryland, which I do know a little bit, you're allowed to have a second layer. You can't have a third, but you're allowed to have two. But like we're going back and forth with this one is like, well, You know, you really shouldn't just lean on the fact that it's two layers and it's not repairable because it's two layers. But do you think that we could use one of those for what?
Well, I mean, I can show you a code that says that you have to go all the way down to the roof deck, you know, and and secondly, again, you have to you have to comply with manufacturer specifications.
No one's going to warranty when you exactly.
Right. I mean, I can shut that down quick, you know, and then a lot. The next challenge, a lot of time is you go to the building official to kind of get their help at the building department. And the next thing is that sometimes they don't understand the building codes. You have to, like, spend some time educating the building official. But, you know, that's just one small thing of what I cover was building codes. Right. And doing things that are that you can do in the contractor lane to win in the contractor lane. I just feel like way too many people hit the easy button on all their claims and they decide to send it out to a public adjuster or send it to appraisal or give it to an attorney. I realize that those are all viable strategies, but I just think that people are They don't exhaust all the options first that are available in the contractor. I think the contractor has the most power for a lot of different reasons that we won't have time to cover. But these are things that I talk about in my events. And more than anything, that the contractor is not hired to fix a roof or to repair a floor. The contractor, when there's an insurance claim involved, I view it as the contractor is hired to perform all repairs that are prescribed by the insurance claim by the insurance adjuster. OK, so like if I go and meet with an insurance adjuster as a contractor and the adjuster knows who I am, they ask me for a copy of the estimate. I said, well, you know, I have sort of the start of an estimate in place, but I was hired as the contractor to perform all repairs that are prescribed by you. And so that's what I'm doing here. I'm here to get my instruction list. I'm here to get my marching orders from you. It's kind of, I played a little different. I let them apply the coverage, let them write the prescription, right? And then I go to carry out the prescription. I realized I can't because It's not sufficient. It doesn't have all the items that it's supposed to have. And then we initiate a supplement. So it's a lot about the mindset. It's like the timing of the play or the position you play on the field. It's a top-down strategy, thinking of it differently. I think a lot of people have themselves in boxes that they shouldn't be in because they heard from here or there. And it's amazing how that's unlocked, you know, solutions for so many contractors over the years. They keep buying these tickets, man. I mean, you talk about the event you missed. I think that's the D.C. event. And that's coming up on April 19th, man. So if you want to you want another crack at it. Yeah. I'll send you some replacement tickets. My man want to go.
I'll be there April 19th. You hear that?
I think there's going to be like 200 contractors there.
There's a way I can sneak in him. And if not, no worries. But we'll make sure we'll do a little you know, we'll do a quick a quick piece of content where I'll snag snag. Yeah, we'll make that happen. No cameras, no cameras. Get out of here. But.
Yeah, so if there's anybody watching this, I doubt there is that ever missed any of my events like you did. If they just contact us, we always give them a replacement.
So let me clear, though, that was completely my fault. So thank you. You're way too kind. And thank you so much. I would. We don't, we don't want you to miss it. And I'm happy to pay again, man. I was, I missed the first one, uh, you know, cause you know how it goes, man. I pay for me, one of my top guys, I'm like, oh man, yeah, yeah. It's a write-off. Great. I get to go see Chad and truth be told. I'm like, Hey, this, this should be very informative. Right? Like we want to learn more. I'm a big advocate for just continued learning now. truth be told again, I try to stay in my lane. And so we run the EOS model and I found where my best, I am a prototypical visionary, sales is my bag. And that's not to say, I can already tell, like you could talk all day, every day, but I'd be curious what your disc profile looks like. Just by nature, because of like how in depth and you're like codes and all this. And like, I wanna know that. I do know a lot because I'm competitive, but it by no means is like my, my strong suit is more people. And like, I'm going to be obsessive about like voice inflection, tonality, you know what I mean? Like just like rapport, right? All these, all these things that Adam, like a lot of the time talks about, and then you combine the two of those and you have this ultimate freaking weapon, like someone like yourself, you know? So I want to learn those things. Cause I know how they're not just in this industry, It's everything. Like you can hit all the doors, you can get all the deals, but you're either keeping and leaving a ton of money on the table or you're not even going to have enough to be sufficient. If you don't get good of those things that Chad's talking about, like you're an insurance restoration and you don't do the things he's talking about, you probably shouldn't be in insurance. You just shouldn't. It's not enough. Go learn retail, right? Like you got to do what he's talking about if you want to make money. I mean, that's just all there is.
I think I say this all the time at my events. I say, You know, this business is unlike any other that I've ever seen where you can. anyone could come to this business from any walk of life, any background, any history, you know, any education level. And, you know, no matter what color they are, what nationality, and they could come in and literally make millions in this business. I see it all the time. You know, it's crazy how much I actually see that. And so I think it's time that we in this business really start to take our craft seriously. you know, and want to be the best that there is in our category, you know, where, where we create a new category, you know, like the blue ocean strategy. I don't know if you heard about that, but it's like, we just, we don't, it's not even, it's not this playing field that we're trying to change. We're creating a whole new playing field, you know, just leveling up. And it just, it thrills me to see contractors all over the country doing that. Like, and they're doing it. So, you know, it's like if you, to your point, if you're going to be in this business, you know, get in where you fit in. I mean, you got to get in there and really start to level up.
We're, you know, we've got where we've got blue collar ballers is like, you know, my and it's it's I don't have a ton of time right now. I just partnered with Ryan Steumann and Todd Price because I just I'm in the middle of a scale in my own business, PCR roofing. And it's just it's way more than I anticipated. I mean, that's just that just is. And so great. You know, an hour my pieces to it. Right. I've liquidated everything there is to like, well, you know, I've got these guys, right. And, and they're all, I've got board of advisors. I've got all these Adams on it. And, and they're all in these areas like Denver, Texas, Missouri, and they're just getting hammered by hail. And we're like, we don't have that. Right. Like it's, it's a whole different deal. We can still get bought. There's a lot of guys that run a good, better, best, that there's just a lot of different players that are being ran. One of my mentors here is MLM and they do things a lot differently too. I don't know if you've heard of them or not, but they're a large company, but just the same, my point is more, like you said, there's so many folks that have taken this and then just created these massive powerhouses, like 100, $150 million. And now PE is just. That's what I was just gonna say.
Yeah, they just, they love to see that.
I'm working towards it. That's all I'm doing is like, I am doing this. How many people are?
Why not?
And a long time, 16 years, 17 years, but either way, like I'm over like the, I used to want to do this perpetually. Like, let's just help guys get this started and do a consultant. I'm doing this one last hoorah. with my folks here and like, we're going to do what everybody else has done and hopefully find ourselves a dancing partner. We're going to, we're going to. And, um, actually we'll have to talk more. Um, we will, but, uh, in that, you know, there's just so much opportunity and it's not just roofing. Like, that's what I wanted to say. Like it started in HVAC and then it was roofing. And then like PE is seeing home service and like these types of businesses, like, you know, let's just dumb down what PE is. It's all the rich folks with money, right? That are like, where can I invest this? Where I'm going to get- They finally figured, they finally discovered what you're over here doing.
Right, exactly. Wait a minute, you do what? For what? And it's recession proof? I mean, yeah, it's ridiculous.
They're hip, man. So, you know, like you said, get in where you fit in and be the best, dude. Like, I mean, that's what, drives me in a sense that like, that's why I had to, you know, like I said, with ballers, I'd love to get you out in an event, man. That's what I was getting at and have you speak. But we try not to just like, our first event was roofing. Cause roofing just gets so much attention right now, dude. Cause like you said, it's hot. And four years ago, what? Solar was the thing. Solar, solar, solar, solar, solar, solar. Oh my God, solar. And then now it's like, eh, I don't know. For me, I'm just like, well, maybe not. Cause I was doing it. but those rates are terrible. And for me and my money, I'm like, look, I'm just focusing on roofing. Like that's what we did last year was we tried to diversify, still ended up 20 points up, but dude, we'd learned a lot of expensive lessons. And one of those was like, let's just focus on one thing. And that's insurance restoration. Currently we can add on the future, but like, right now, let's get this do the best we can at this one thing. And then, you know, then we can add some other stuff. So I love that you're preaching that. And I will be out there in April. What is your your is it you said the acronym again?
Yes, yeah. And it's just the class is called it's an insurance restoration masterclass is what we call it. And Yeah, it's insurancerestorationtraining.com. If anybody wants to check that out, there's a link there.
I've seen some of the modules. He didn't have me on to plug any of his stuff or anything like that. This is truly organic. I've seen it. And Chad genuinely knows what he's talking about. I wouldn't say that otherwise, right? So I mean that. I appreciate it, man. It's phenomenal. He knows his stuff. I will be going out there. I mean, my time is so short. these days. And I'm so blessed, but I can promise you, I will. Absolutely. I'm telling Roger now we'll be there. We'll be there. I won't miss it twice. I'd like to bring, uh, I appreciate that, man.
I mean, listen, that's, that's the live version, you know, but my, uh, online training course, I already said that it's IES certified.com. It's different, you know, the stuff you saw very different. It's, uh, you know, you're sitting there, it's a module, you get, you know, you complete the module, you take a test, and it's just me sitting there talking on camera. There's audio and video, whereas the live is very different. You know, it's engaging, you have all these contractors, we do questions and answers just openly, just whenever you want, raise your hand. They're not like, it's not like a designated time. Um, so I do, that's what makes every event different. I mean, it just say you have contractors coming, we tell them ahead of time, like bring your questions. You know, if you have a complicated scenario, bring it. Um, and it's just like a fire hose of information that goes out all day long. Uh, great lunch. We have a huge buffet lunch in the middle of it, you know, so we try, try to do a good job with that. But yeah, in fact, I believe it's the Marriott College Park is where that's going to be at is a big, you know, kind of convention center. I think it is. And there's I just did the menu recently, so it's going to be awesome. So I hope you do get out to that. I will. And you asked about, you know, already, and I'll help you out here just to keep it on track. You asked about like what you wanted to know what my story was, you know, how I got here.
He almost let me let me slide, but started talking about roofing.
Yeah, it's OK, because I know you have people that are not in the roofing industry, too. And I just. Uh, you know, I'm 46 years old and, um, I've been an entrepreneur my whole freaking life, you know, part of that time without knowing it, but 17 years old, I was, I got a job selling Kirby vacuum cleaners door to door. And I know you didn't know that. Yeah, you didn't know that. But hold on, don't don't respect me yet, man, because that was not that was not good for me. All right. I mean, it's like, before the millennium, and there was no cell phones, there were no cell phones. And that they had a bunch of us, they dropped us off in a van in Kentucky. And I lived in Dayton, Ohio. So that's where I'm from. And Kettering, actually. And it's like an hour and a half, you know, over the border, they dropped us off in like a random neighborhood. We were walking around knocking on doors. There's no way to get back. You know, this is the way to call anybody. We're just stuck out there. You had to knock on doors. We were stuck in these demos for hours. People were trying to get rid of us and dumping salt on the floor and doing all this stuff and vacuuming it. And and so, I mean, honestly, just a few days of that and on my way either home or to I think I was on my way to the morning sales meeting, like on my third day, probably. And I saw a sign on a telephone pole that for another job. And I called that and it was Cutco, if you'd ever heard of that. Cutco cutlery, you know, cutlery, but, uh, yeah. Right. And, uh, so I jumped into that. I went to an interview and, um, you know, I wasn't as impressed when they told me, Oh, we think you could have a lot of potential. Cause that's what Kirby already did, you know, but I went there, got the job. And I was amazing at that job. I was really good at it. Like when I was 17, I made 52 grand. And so it just kind of ruined me. I got into the management side, had a really, really good boss. It was Vector Marketing is the company that runs all the marketing and sales for that. And so, you know, went to like a group interview and then it was like group training, like training meetings and the psychology behind sales and like watching tapes or I mean, listening to tapes, like, and reading books from like Zig Ziglar. Oh, yeah, dude. And then like Dale Carnegie, how to win friends and influence. Yeah, that kind of stuff, going to these big conferences and conventions.
that brothers where it's like, do we just become best friends? Yeah.
It was like a bunch of, uh, you know, college kids, you know, and I, and so what happened to me though, is that I was going to go to college, but I didn't have a lot of good direction at home. My parents, you know, divorced kind of a broken home, um, and not a lot of direction. And I didn't really understand the huge importance of it. And I decided, to take the year off after high school. Right. And then I would do it because I was making so much money. And then, of course, after that, I tried like a semester. It didn't do well. I was not a good student. Didn't do well that making bank, bro. I know. I was like, I thought I had it all figured out. And of course, I didn't. I mean, I wanted to go bigger and better after that. Like my boss at Vector, he moved regions and I decided not to go with him. That probably I probably needed to stay with that dude, you know, cause I got away from him and, and then I didn't stay with, you know, doing the cutco thing. I thought I was going to go and flip real estate real fast and get rich real quick. And, and it just didn't, you know, obviously it didn't work out. And I actually, this is where, this is a part I told you on the phone that'll surprise you. Okay. And I used to, it's in my training course. I used to say this at every one of my events in the beginning, I thought I had to, But I actually, at 19, found myself sitting in federal prison, dude. So go from all of that, from curvy, you know, cut code knives, and all of a sudden I'm in prison, you know, at 19 on a credit card fraud scheme. That's what it was. And I just, I'm real about it. And, you know, found myself in a mound of trouble. I had a federal case, multiple state cases in different counties. It was all kind of wrapped up in the same deal. I found myself on the news in my hometown, like embarrassed my family. Everyone, you know, went went to jail, went to prison, got out of that, was on probation in all these different counties, violated the probation, had to go back. I wish that I could say.
Dude, so I'm a felon myself, so we're actually, you know, I don't know how much you know about me, but we're kindred spirits there, brother.
I mean, dude, I just and some people that have been following me for a while may be surprised by this because I haven't talked. I don't talk about it anymore, you know, unless it comes up or whatever. These shows, I get it, though. These shows, I like to I like to bring it up. But I felt like I had to explain it all the time, right? And just, you know, fast forwarding through that, I obviously screwed up my life really bad early on. And, you know, it took me a while to really mature and grow up and become an adult and start to realize that I want these things. I want to be self-employed, but you have to earn them the right way. You have to put in the time. You have to put in the grind. I wish that I could say that I was strung out on drugs and that I was an alcoholic. I wasn't any of those things. I was surrounded by that. My whole family, my mom, my siblings, you know, everybody has their own demons, bad problems. And I'm just so lucky, so fortunate that I think I probably could have been. You know, I probably could have been down. I mean, I could have easily gone down that path. I mean, I messed around, but I never I can't blame it on that. It was mostly just. selfish and wanting to do things my own way, cutting shortcuts, but eventually I got it together and this industry really saved me. I found myself, I had a landscaping company, I wanted to be an entrepreneur and then having the felonies, it just made it such, you know, so much more difficult to go and work for other people. I tell people all the time, like, I'm unemployable, I always have been, like, I've always been an entrepreneur. So I started a landscaping company, went too fast with that had 40 employees, you know, in my early 20s. brash that business, you know, under the ground, um, found myself looking for work and I was in the help one and saw an ad for roofing sales just before the millennium. And, um, got into that. I, there was a hail storm in Dayton where I'm from, and I didn't know that hail did that. I didn't know that they replaced the roofs. And I wish I could say, I just, I was awesome at it, but I wasn't because you had to measure the roofs by hand. Then they didn't have the Eagle stuff. And, It was very difficult for me. But then I was kind of in and out of that. And then the hurricanes of 2004 in Florida, there was hurricanes Jean, Francis, Ivan and Charlie that hit within a month. I went there sink or swim, baby. You know, that's what I really got good. I learned I started, you know, doing the exact same sort of learning, making money the right way, serving people, helping people. It just you know, I got married 2001. I had a daughter in 2009, and she's 14 now. I ended up moving to Florida for five years, then went to Dallas for 15 years, worked a lot of hurricanes, a lot of storms. I was a contractor for 10 years. Ended up selling that business, got out of it. I wasn't happy. being the jack of all trades, doing the whole everything. I loved the insurance side, the inspections, estimates, supplements. That's where I was really a killer. And so getting out of the business, away from being a contractor and having my own company for 10 years, I started doing supplementing, virtual estimating, 2010. It was before anyone else was doing it. I was the first website, you know, ended up selling that many years later. And, uh, and then just doing the training, you know, I've been doing training and consulting, uh, ever since, you know, I've been doing these events now I'm on my fifth year, uh, six, seven years of, since the training course came out, uh, things are, you know, really, you know, I'm on YouTube, Chad, Michael, the practitioner, please subscribe, uh, shameless play there. But, uh, I, I just, I wanted to kind of, cause you told me the nature of kind of what you'd like to talk about on these shows. And I want to connect with someone out there that is hearing that because here's the part. It's not really all the bad stuff. But I spent too many years, OK, and I was 100 pounds heavier than I am right now. I had high blood pressure. I spent too many years living in shame. I'm scared to death, terrified that people would find that stuff out about me, that they would expose me, you know, and like, and that happened, you know, in business relationships, people would, would dig up stuff on me and try to, you know, get terms more favorable to them kind of blackmail and extorting. And, um, and listen, what I want to say is it happened like in 2016, 2017, maybe, um, where, Someone put a post in a group, you know, like had a background check on me from 20 years ago and had all this dirt in there. And a lot of the stuff wasn't even accurate. They'll link me with other things, you know, and it was horrible. It was the thing that I was most afraid of. And people were cracking on me and commenting. And it was it was it was terrible. And like it was like my worst fear came true. The next day, though, dude, the sun still came up the same way that it always did before. Like all my friends are still intact. My family's still intact. My clients are still intact. Like nothing really changed. And it was the best thing that ever happened to me. So what I realized, man. Is that I had to own my own story and I had to be responsible for my own story and not let everybody else control my story. And what I knew was that all that was behind me. Those failures don't define me. I'd earned my own way on the merits as far as the substance of what my teaching is, the results. And the results speak for themselves all over the country. And I just realized I have to be authentic. I have to be my own, free to be my own self. and not worry about what other people think about me. And really, except for the people that matter to me the most that are in my inner circle, I very much worry about what they think about me. And I can't tell you how much I've grown. Like you said, I just grew to another level. That's what happened. That's what happened. Once I got beyond that and I realized I'm just going to be my true self. And if people don't like me, they're going to stay away from me. And the people that do really follow my content and they're loyal to me, They do that knowing the real me, the real me. And my business since then has blown up. It's blown up like I'm because I've just been able to be myself with no hindrances, like not not worrying about what other people think. And, you know, you make a mistake, you own it. Right. America loves a comeback story. And so I just I want to say that to anybody out there that's watching this where that just hits you different. You know, I've had a lot of people come up to me at these events and tell me their story that they say, nobody else knows this. I've had this problem. I've had these problems through those problems, get beyond them, you know, fix your problems, own, own your problems and move on and take, you know, take control of your own destiny and step into the purpose that you're meant to step into in the first place. Part of these problems, your failures, where you've let people down and you've truly screwed up and you've been ashamed of that, you wouldn't be the person you are today without those problems. They are the ingredients that makes up you, that makes you who you are, makes your brand, And I know one thing, I couldn't do a fraction of what I do today, you know, coming out to these rooms of 200 or more people and doing it with ease, by the way, and helping people like crazy. I wouldn't be a fraction of what I am today without those failures. I mean, it'd be one thing if I continued, you know, repetitively, like you just see where Chad's continued doing that all those years. Right. But There comes a point in time where you have to make a change. Something in you is enough to where you change those behaviors. You can see that doing things the same way are not working out. You must make some severe changes on the inside. For me, that was probably my daughter the most. In 2009, I changed the most. She means the most to me. It's like the reason why I breathe. It's my purpose on Earth. Have a good reason.
Have a strong why your why stronger than your how, as they say. Wow. I did not expect any of this. I told you you'd be surprised. Yeah, dude. I know. He's like, this is the quietest I've heard Ken on this podcast, probably ever, ever. He said ever as a record. I've just been sitting here listening this whole time, which takes a lot. But with my. But I've just been stunned, man, because one, you kind of Not said my story, but in a way you did, because, of course, I did have the drugs and alcohol. But whatever. Right. Like whatever it was that got you to it.
Many people watching this right now are caught up in that right now. And you know what? It's it's kept secret, too. Right. That's another part that makes it so hard on you and everybody around you. It's like that fight that you're fighting inside. Go ahead. I'm sorry.
The thousand pound gorilla, you know, and yeah, for me, it was the same thing, man. Like when I first came back, I've only been back from the dead myself for six, seven years in August. So six years, right. Like literally like. Nothing, I mean, sleeping outside, no possessions, nothing, no bank account, you know. Nothing, you know, and my wife was the attorney that I met with to declare bankruptcy when I got back from that. And she told me not to do it. And if I did, I wouldn't have had the business I have now or any of the other things that we the house, the things like. And, you know, fortunately, I had been in this industry before and always, I'd always done well for short periods, but, you know, I could never stay sober, man. And so, but to your point, I was so ashamed of that when I first came back around, like, I didn't want to be on Facebook. I don't want to be on any of the social media. I did. It was like, if you go back and look, it's just all these, like, shameless selfies like in attempts to be like, oh, I'm good now. You know what I mean? Like nothing. But at least I'm not out robbing people because, dude, I come from a town where like everyone knows what you did. And like I hurt myself. Like, man, I heard you robbed this store with an AK. And I'm like, I that's news to me, man.
But the stories grow through the years, man. I look, you know, I told you I'm from Ohio and same here, man. Everybody knows that stuff back home and and just thrilling. I just did an event for one hundred and fifty contractors Friday in Columbus, my home state, the capital of my home state. And when I come back now, it's just way different now. It's like you have this whole different story now where they're not there because they knew me back then. It's a whole, like I've recreated and changed really who I am entirely, entirely.
By the grace of God, brother, I swear. By the grace of God, there go I. That's it. I say that all the time. The big thing we said on the call before this that I want to point out, and the message I believe Chad was really driving at was like, by being your authentic self and not being afraid, like the same thing, you take all the power away from that thing that you're hiding. Just like, you know what? I'm going to embrace this. I'm going to put it all on the front street instead of just being so afraid, like, oh, God, what if this ever comes out? Like, dude, you know what? I'm going to make this a big part it is part of my story first of all so it's like it's not at that part it's not but i'm going to share this with everybody else Because I believe that not doing that is inherently just selfish. Like, I'm glad you brought that up. Yes. Yes. Oh, like, dude, I know you're doing you've sold two companies. Now you're on your third and you're living your best life, dude. You look great. You got, you know, pearly white. You're in the best shape of your life. Got a beautiful family like that looks so great and so appealing. It only looks like. But to the guy that's going through what you went through at 19, it looks insurmountable. It looks out of his reach. You know what it is?
Yes. And, you know, too many people give up on life. Yes. Because that's they've convinced themselves that it's insurmountable. Right. But you're right. I'm so glad you brought that up, because that's what we were talking about earlier. Right. It's like at some point you're you're taking away from other people because there are people that just need you in that way. They need they need that because that'll be the one little thing to give them what hope like that's like you need hope to keep on living. And so it's just, yeah, man, I love to hear people's stories because and what you said, you take the power out of that. You know, I get so many trolls like on Facebook and different things and for various people that don't know me for the most part, and they'll be like, this guy looks like a jackass or whatever. You know, I've heard everything, by the way. I love it now. It's like therapy responding to the trolls, like increases the algorithm. But right. But there'll be some people that did know me from back then, occasionally surface, you know, just every now and then, not as much anymore. But whenever they know, be like, like I had this guy recently he posted, he goes, does anybody know who this guy is from Dayton, Ohio? And he had one of my Facebook sponsored ads in his post. he was trying to expose me to the community or whatever, right? What happened instead is that all my supporters came in there. They didn't understand that he was trying to do that. They just thought that he was trying to give me a shout out. They're all like, yeah, he's badass. I've learned all my stuff from him. And just like, you know, I mean, so whenever somebody comes in there is like, people know about your pathway. Yeah. Like go to this video. I put it on YouTube. I told my whole story though. Here's the link. You know, like you go tell everybody you want to, like, I've already told everybody, but go right ahead. So yeah, you can totally take that scene out of that. If that's the thing that you're afraid of, if you would just own it, right? And just own who you are, that you're not perfect. None of us are perfect. There's so many people that have made mistakes and have come back. You know, so people that continue in those mistakes, you know, that may need some more time, right?
And there's a lot of people that didn't get caught in the things and behaviors I had. And I'm not even going to hear that all the time.
Yeah.
Yeah. A lot of folks that well, first of all, I have one in particular, but he wouldn't give me the same respect. But I'm not going to blast him on this. But, you know, he works so hard. You know, your reputation is what people think about you. But your character is who you are. Right. Absolutely. He only truly, really cares about his reputation. He works so hard. to make others believe that. And I knew when we had done something together and I knew that he was only he leveraged my past a lot. Right. And like I was still new. And and like you said, I didn't feel like I had a voice. He was smart. He got a lot out of me because I wasn't confident back then. I felt like I couldn't speak up because I was still so new. And I'm like, you know, I don't speak up. And now I'm like, look, man, you couldn't expose me because I've made it like the crux of who I am. Like, yeah, this is, I am in recovery. I did all of the, I've smoked this, shot that, like terrible things. I've made countless videos about it. But like, I also want people to know that because if you're in that right now, brother, if I can do it, you can absolutely do it. Like if I can get back from that, if Chad can get back from that. And at one point we thought, dude, it's over. And I and I know you probably felt how I did when I got a I had a college degree, which was dumb, but whatever. I got it. And I went and got a felony. And I was like that and I'm a complete loser for the rest of my life and I'll never do anything with this. And then I fell off. Unfortunately, I found remodeling sales and we don't care. You know what I mean? You're going back. Right.
I imagine that had to be discouraged, discouraging. You spent so much time accomplishing that. Right. And then you're like, oh, I just threw it, you know, threw it all away. And, you know, it's just I hope that we can pass along that to is that, you know, again, I'm 46 and I wish that Obviously, I wish I knew when I was 19 what I know now. It's just so many times I've been in crises where I thought it was the end of the world. situations that I had to deal with. And, and, you know, I could put myself up against anybody's like, I think, you know, those were insurmountable. Those were traumatizing experiences that anybody, most people won't ever have to go through. But you know what? You get through them. And when you look back on them, it seems like such a small period of time in your life. And there's just so many times, like you said, you were literally homeless, brother. Yeah. I mean, what's worse than that? you know, if you take everything from me and I'm out, I have no shelter, no food, no nothing, you know, like just something like that. Most people are not going to have to get to that level, that point, you know. So there's always somebody out there that has it worse. This too shall pass. You know, I just, we need to just, Put it, stop and breathe, breathe, put everything in perspective and start making an action plan on what we're going to do to change things around. You know, if you find yourself in a situation, anybody that's looking at this right now and they may be in that situation right now where you think, you know, you don't see how you can get out of there's no future for you. There is a future like you can remake yourself over and over and over and over again. There's so much time that you have left. You know, we even myself at 46, my life could be over tomorrow. But but then again, it could be it could go on for another 50 years. You know, we have a lot of time left. And so the time starts now.
Read through that. I would have never guessed that this would have gone stops now. Yeah. Dad, I wanna make sure you get all your plugs, man. Where can everybody follow you, find you, use your roofer, first of all, check out his stuff. Again, make sure, I'm gonna let you plug all that, everything.
Yeah, I mostly have, it's Chad Michael, The Practitioner. If you look that up on Google, that should direct you everywhere. I've got podcasts. You can even say, ask Siri, who is Chad Michael, The Practitioner? It'll direct you to all the stuff. Um, but podcast, a YouTube channel by the same name, Chad, Michael, the practitioner I E S certified.com is my online training course. And, uh, insurance restoration training.com is my main hub where you can find everything on my social media, LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and Tik TOK now.
Yeah. Stay with the times, dude. We've been funny. Tick tocks recently trying to get people. I don't know the motivational stuff, not catching yet. So we're trying to use a little bit of humor. We'll see if that works, but I'm pumping it out there. And it's like five viewers, 20 viewers, 400 viewers. Eventually one of these is going to hit.
I mean, inconsistency is key, dude. I'm going to tell you. So I saw your story about your, your wife and you wrote about, I saw a big post that you had on Facebook where you told the whole story. I think maybe you were giving her a shout out or something, but maybe it was an anniversary or something. I don't know what it was, but you had a big thing that you wrote about how she was your attorney. And I just was really moved by that. I shared it with somebody else at the time. And that's a good example of just and being who you are, you know, and people love you anyway, the people that matter. So 100%.
100%. Again, I didn't think this would go this way, but I think this is one of the most impactful episodes that we've had. We can talk about how to make it, how to do this, how to do that, and Chad can help you. If you're in the roofing space, just utilize his services. You will make it. But if you're an entrepreneur or you're in any spot in your life, whether it's personal, professional development or anything like what he said, like he said, it's different. Everyone has that that they're going through at some point in their life. I think that the overall theme for today is embracing that, taking away its power and realizing at any point in time, like we can take back control, take action towards building something.
Just be and have the ability and the freedom to be your freaking self. Don't let anybody else take that power away from you, you know?
I love it, man. Chad, I think, my friend, I'm really looking forward to seeing you on April 19th, man. We will be there. We will be there.
Likewise, man. I'll get you some tickets. So, and I can't wait to see you.
That would be great. If not, I'm happy to pay for them. I just want to make sure we get them.
I know you are. Yeah, I don't know, but you already paid for them. So, I want you there.
All right, brother. I appreciate it so much. And we will catch you hopefully soon. And just the same, we'll see you here in a few weeks. Thank you. Likewise, man.
Thanks so much for having me on. Big, big shout out to you. Keep winning, brother. We'll see you.
Bye, friend. We won't stop. Can't stop, won't stop. Thank you, brother. All right, man. Take care.
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